EasyBrexit 5pts Hello everyone,We are currently setting up a information system that will assist firms through the next few years of the Brexit. You can leave your email here if you are interested and we will get back to you once everything is in place in the coming couple of weeks." http://easybrexit.com/
MarkSand 5pts The biggest economic issue about relations of EU and UK after Brexit is certainly free trade zone. EU chief officials already claimed that it will not remain the way it was before. Of course, European countries will not stop trading with Britain, but the losses tend to be a way to big. When I was reading this infographic http://www.paraphrasingserviceuk.com/brexit-debate-remain-and-leave-camps/ (analyzing pro and cons of Brexit) I realized that there is a strange contradiction involved. People who argue for Brexit, usually do this because of national sovereignty concerns. However, staying in the European trade zone, without being an EU member, means submit regulation without the right to change/block it.
john timbrell 5pts @MarkSand Mark we already have to comply with the EU conditions in just the same way as we have to apply to the American conditions if we sell to them. The figures quoted are just guesswork. If you still want Brexit please reasd and support this.WINNING THE EU REFERENDUM WAS ONLY STEP NUMBER ONE, AND NOW WE MUST SET THE AGENDA FOR OUR FREEDOM!RE: THE KILMUIR LETTER - A MATTER FOR PARLIAMENTARY DISCUSSIONThe Kilmuir letter contains crucial evidence to prove that the EU Treaties were and still are illegal and they need to be overturned. If you haven't already signed this petition, then please do so, today! It will help us to set the agenda for our freedom, but if we leave it to the politicians, you KNOW what will happen!Very urgent: Please sign and support the petition and get family and friends to sign it.https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122770You may be thinking that we no longer need to expose the details in the Kilmuir letter, but if anything, it's even MORE important now that we have won the EU referendum. The media are not mentioning the illegality of the EU Treaties and the government will not allow the illegal treaties to be debated in parliament. So, we need to force the issue to be reported on.However, the government has to COMMENT on it if the petition reaches 10,000. And, when the government comments on it, the media are allowed to report it. We must ALL do our bit to make sure this happens!Very urgent: Please sign and support the petition and get family and friends to sign it.https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122770
katiegerard073 5pts I am writing this review to tell the entire world how i adopted a child from a Center known as babycenter.nett@gmail.com that i met Online, I was directed to this Adoptive Center by a friend of mine that claimed she adopted a child from them, When i contacted this Center, I was given all the requirements in adopting a baby and after following the due process, The baby in question that i need to adopt was given out to me to mother. I am so happy that i finally had a baby girl that i can call My daughter and she can call me Mother. I adopted this baby because i am suffering from Cancer and My Doctor told me i can't give birth. I will continuing sharing this testimony of mine and let the world know that there is a legit baby center out here where you can adopt a child. For contact and counselling, You can contact the adoptive Center on: babycenter.nett@gmail.com
katiegerard073 5pts I am writing this review to tell the entire world how i adopted a child from a Center known as babycenter.nett@gmail.com that i met Online, I was directed to this Adoptive Center by a friend of mine that claimed she adopted a child from them, When i contacted this Center, I was given all the requirements in adopting a baby and after following the due process, The baby in question that i need to adopt was given out to me to mother. I am so happy that i finally had a baby girl that i can call My daughter and she can call me Mother. I adopted this baby because i am suffering from Cancer and My Doctor told me i can't give birth. I will continuing sharing this testimony of mine and let the world know that there is a legit baby center out here where you can adopt a child. For contact and counselling, You can contact the adoptive Center on: babycenter.nett@gmail.com
MoleBath 5pts Polling day is drawing near and more and more people are warming to BREXIT. One more effort and we will be free of the shackles of EU bureaucrats , also an end to Merkel's lectures
paul1333g 5pts The undemocratic and corporate lobbiest controlled model of the EU is enough of a reason to leave. The financial hypnotism is just a smoke screen.But, here is another financial reason for those who plan to buy a home or first time buyers.Stamp duty in UK is 0 for most people I think. Cost to buy in SPain with stamp duty and regulations.... 10% ( depending on if you have loan )France around 7%-9Germany around 6% With greater "integration", if you choose to stay, how long do you think before property purchase tax is harmonised across the E.U.? And will it be harmonised to the UK values near 0 or French / Germany 6% to9%
Derrick Wyatt 5pts @paul1333g All tax harmonisation requires unanimity. I see no chance of the UK agreeing to harmonisation of the tax you mention.
jonathan63 5pts @Derrick Wyatt @paul1333g Unfortunately, in life life, nothing stands still and neither will the integration juggernaut of the EU. Every step along the way from the initial concept in the 1950's has been moving towards a Federal State where they expect to give us all one suit and think that will fit all. Our precious veto has become sound bite and nothing more. The process is already in place for majority voting so the UK will have no say anyway.
smokeyraver 5pts There's no economical argument to stay in the eu if u really look into the nitty gritty, there will not be tarrif wars, if there is put tarrifs in our pharmaceutical drugs and chemicals we produce, no one would want to go down that road. Ever wonder why bananas from brazil cost 60p a kg even with the distances involved, thats because the eu can't produce them, and if they did they did yous be paying ten times because they would be over priced over regulated with import vat and they wouldn't let brazil sell u them in the first place because its protective barriers against competition
jomu1950 5pts @smokeyraver The route to exit is already designed into article 50...we give notice to leave. We then have two years to negotiate trade deals. No agreements after two years, WTO tariffs apply. Simple. The other option is: give notice to leave. We join the EFTA and continue trading as now, along with all the bits that brexiters don't want (and the EU contribution and free movement)Article 50 is the only relatively pain-free option. Just saying "goodbye" and walking out means tariffs will be raised immediately.
john timbrell 5pts @jomu1950 @smokeyraver No offence meant but you have been mind controlled. Replay Cameron's comments about the Lisbon Treaty when in opposition. He knows it's designed to stop any country leaving and anyway is subject to qualified majority voting. Even your own answer should have alerted you to the fact that the contiuning uncertainty which all markets hate would change the mind of the Brexiteers.This is how we should leave but it requires effort from you Mr. and Mrs. Public. The media and people like Farage cannot do it because the government has put a D notice on them,All EU treaties are Illegal according to the top law officer. Lord Kilmuir wrote to Edward Heath and told him that it would be illegal to sign the first treaty the treaty of Rome. Go here to read the treaty.https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122770Then ask your self when you are caught out doing something wrong. Answer you have to stop. If by your help we can get this petition to 10,000 the government has to comment on it. Hopefully then, because the government has put the subject into the public arena, the media and people like Farage can discuss it. So when I wrote that you had been mind controlled it is not just you. It was me at one time and most of the population today. So please talk and talk about it. It is down to you as individuals.
smokeyraver 5pts And im sure the free trade agreement with eu will continue on brexit there's loads of polish and European shops bases here, Lidl's and Aldi will want it, and if they put tarrifs on imported cars costs would incentivise uk buyers to buy UK cars, car industry will do very well out of that id say
smokeyraver 5pts I think regarding trade your better of out, im sure eu' v.a.t intake from uk alone is around 15 percent of all its vat revenue, that alone shows how much they need us, before mentioning the other money from membership, also uk gdp has risen the magic 6 percent in the last 3 years and no household I no is 4000 pound better, so that osbourne arguments not worth crap
smokeyraver 5pts There's definitely winners and losers with the outcome of in or out, if your low paid, paying high rent and watching house prices rise, and sick to death of a bursting infrastructure of which the government cannot afford to keep up to scratch with a high burst of population you will be better of out, if u own property, own a business that u want to grow with minimum wage labour on tap,or have shares or pensions related to the ftse 100 u will be better of remaining
smokeyraver 5pts There's definitely winners and losers with the putcome of in or out, if your low paid, paying high rent and watching house prices rise, and sick to death of a bursting infrastructure of which the government cannot afford to
iloveuk 5pts Perhaps the UK should rock the boat, leave and open up the massive trade opportunities with Russia and the CIS. There is enormous Russian investments in the UK. The way Europe and the US are going the Russian markets will all be grabbed by China.
john timbrell 5pts @iloveuk You will need to do more than vote leave to get us out of the EU. Cameron knows the Lisbon treaty is a can of worms and is designed to stop any country leaving. What you are not being told by anybody is that all EU treaties are illegal. Don't believe me check out what the top law officer in the UK wrote to Prime minister Edward Heath.He was blackmiled into signing the first illegal treaty. Since then each government had to keep the letter secret so much so that the media and Eurosceptic promoters dare not mention it.So secret in fact that the parliament did not understand the significance of this petition and accepted it. Because Of the general secrecy it needs individuals like you to promote it. I have been blocked on some sites because they do not like my message so please use any site or facebook and get the fact that the treaties are illegal out into the public arena.https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122770
iloveuk 5pts Optical fiber communications was invented by a Chinese gentleman called Prof Charles Kao
paul1333g 5pts How can any serious comment on the result of leaving not discuss Greenland.In case anyone is not aware Greenland escaped the E.U. in 1984.After this their GDP rocketed upwards.
john timbrell 5pts @paul1333g Greenlan should be discussed.You will need to do more than vote leave to get us out of the EU. Cameron knows the Lisbon treaty is a can of worms and is designed to stop any country leaving. What you are not being told by anybody is that all EU treaties are illegal. Don't believe me check out what the top law officer in the UK wrote to Prime minister Edward Heath.He was blackmiled into signing the first illegal treaty. Since then each government had to keep the letter secret so much so that the media and Eurosceptic promoters dare not mention it.So secret in fact that the parliament did not understand the significance of this petition and accepted it. Because Of the general secrecy it needs individuals like you to promote it. I have been blocked on some sites because they do not like my message so please use any site or facebook and get the fact that the treaties are illegal out into the public arena.https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122770
knock_knock 5pts @paul1333g The economy of Greenland can be characterized as small, mixed and vulnerable.[4] Greenland's economy consists of a big public sector and comprehensive foreign trade, which has resulted in an economy with periods of strong growth, considerable inflation, unemployment problems and extreme dependence on capital inflow from Denmark and use of outside, mainly Danish, skilled labor.[4]The GDP of Greenland is 1.6 Billion GBP i.e. tiny. This is certainly not an example to follow or to use as an example of what will happen to the UK.
Kennyboyt 5pts So were told the Uk cant go it alone:Lets be proud :We started the Industrial revolution.We ran and EmpireEnglish is the Worlds languageDarwins evolutionDiscovered DNA helixInvented TVInvented the first computer ( bletchly Park )Not only did we invent the Internet we :invented fibre optic communicationI think Im right Southampton Uni invented the small laser that allows the light to be transmitted down the fibres"Packet switching" used to encode the data was invented at the Post Officeetc etc etcTheres many more but I wont go on.STOP SELLING THE UK SHORT
john timbrell 5pts @Kennyboyt See here to see a way outhttps://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122770
puffone 5pts @Kennyboyt Well,"Britannia (England) rules the waves", once.You can insert also radar in the list and Penicillin (1928) by Scottish scientist Alexander Fleming, but:# the mechanical of the Scottish Baird TV (1925) was based on the German Nipkow disk (1884) that in turn led to first use of the word television from the Russian Perskyi in the International Congress of Electricity (1900, Paris). French inventors also pioneered. Wiki can help (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_television)For the left Wiki will provide coevolution and cross-fertilization in history of computing and internet.# The World uses the English language (a mix of Latin French and Anglo-Saxon) because of United States of America leadership (until 1950 the World used French as exchange language).
john timbrell 5pts @puffone @Kennyboyt Rule bBitannia @paul1333g Greenlan should be discussed.You will need to do more than vote leave to get us out of the EU. Cameron knows the Lisbon treaty is a can of worms and is designed to stop any country leaving. What you are not being told by anybody is that all EU treaties are illegal. Don't believe me check out what the top law officer in the UK wrote to Prime minister Edward Heath.He was blackmiled into signing the first illegal treaty. Since then each government had to keep the letter secret so much so that the media and Eurosceptic promoters dare not mention it.So secret in fact that the parliament did not understand the significance of this petition and accepted it. Because Of the general secrecy it needs individuals like you to promote it. I have been blocked on some sites because they do not like my message so please use any site or facebook and get the fact that the treaties are illegal out into the public arena.https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122770
knock_knock 5pts @Kennyboyt I am from Greece. Shall I list the things we gave to mankind? Look at where we are now. The past is certainly not a guide of what will happen in the future. You need to think that most politicians, sadly ,are not after the prosperity of the country but about reelection and short term success.
knock_knock 5pts @puffone @Kennyboyt Yes and internet was discovered at CERN or whatever. Please everyone stop your nationalistic propaganda and think what is REALLY the best choice for the country.
puffone 5pts @knock_knock @puffone @Kennyboyt That was I meant by writing of co-evolution and cross-fertilization (fertilisation, if preferred) among the different national craddles of ideas, inventions and applications, i.e. the European (and USA) indistinguishable common culture (shared knowledge, if preferred).I am pretty concerned of the tradegies of European history, so I need more Europe, preferably according to the model of the British Union (UK) of the four Nations: England, Alba (Scotland), Cymru (Wales) and Tuaisceart Éireann (N. Ireland).
Stelianandroff 5pts Idiot the first computer is inveted by the american/bulgarian scientist John Atanasov in the States In bleatcly park you invented a machine which can crack the german Enigma By your idiotic logic we can say that the first computer was the nazi enigma .....And if you dont know the electric field transmisions and many other inventions in the base of the todays electronic is invented from another great eastern european e.g serbian Nikola Tesla not in cambridge or hackney or brixton ... oh yes you english invented the wheel ..ha.ha
puffone 5pts Could you imagine why an European as I'm is a fanatic of an Englexit (not really a Brexit)?Do you think that peoples of GB really prefer leaving the loose European Union against the tight British Union under the dominancy of English people?
markwhite208 5pts According to the Open Europe report, UK GDP could be 2.2% lower in 2030 if Britain left the EU. But since around 150,000 EU migrants come to the UK every year, the population would be nearly 2 million (about 3%) less. So the effect of Brexit on GDP per capita would be somewhere between neutral and positive. Why didn't the report analyse the effect of Brexit on GDP per capita, which is a far better indicator of national prosperity than raw output?
Stur 5pts Which report has made that conclusion ? We can exchange hard working young people with returning pensioners, that would be clever
markwhite208 5pts The Open Europe report makes this conclusion. It's on this page. Try reading it before parading your prejudices. It clearly shows that leaving the EU will not damage the UK economy. As for your claim that pensioners will be expelled from EU countries and be forced to return to the UK after Brexit, this is nonsense. It would be in breach of international treaties and would probably result in the retaliatory expulsion of EU migrants who live in this country. Finally, you conveniently ignore the fact that young EU migrants are not immune to the effects of ageing and so will eventually become pensioners and dependent on the state. In other words, the argument that this country needs young workers to fund the pensions of an elderly population is a false one as it is based on the logic of the Ponzi scheme.
Stur 5pts Because it's a retarded question, are you saying that if a person contributes a million pound to the economy over forty years and takes out 200000 in their last years, that is bad for an economy,? That's how successful economies work Is this what passes for UKIP gotcha questions nowadays?
john timbrell 5pts I doubt if you are aware of this, I managed to get it on the parliament petitions website because I do not think they realised it's significance.https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122770
Stur 5pts Waffle vs reality. Markets and currency falling on fears of Brexit , No doubt UKIP/ Brexiters will have a perfectly good account for this in their conspiratal world. People don't follow waffle they look for evidence. Grow up and try doing a critical thinking course. There's a reason why 75% of people with degrees vote remain.
lambolives 5pts @Stur amazing that you quote people with degrees as being something worth thinking about. The ability to regurgitate verbatim the prejudices of the lecturer in front of you would hardly seem conclusive evidence of an enquiring mind. Any type of critical thinking would instantly show that the reason you want to stay in the EU gravy train is either (a) it benefits you personally or (b) you're too thick to work out the answers for yourself to complex questions - but then you're a graduate of an education system that condems free thinking and rewards mimicry - whilst propagandising the opposite.
lambolives 5pts @markwhite208 All good points Mark. The stayers never want to face the 'young migrants getting old ' question. It seems beyond their comprehension. Well done for trying, though I doubt they have the wit to understnad basic statistics other wise they wouldn't bring the topic up in the first place.
Stur 5pts Pesky clever people!!! They're always thwarting Brexit/UKIP talking pointsWe have an example when a nation turns its back on evidence and is critical of experts and informed opinion ,, it's called "Donald trump". Brexiters are informed by Press Barons,dodgy entrepreneurs , and cheap politicians like Farage, unfortunately for you people in this country don't do demagogues so you'll be back in your cage come June
Stur 5pts @Stur oh! ok you've been able to define a ponzi scheme, what has that got to do with Brexit,This is typical UKIP waffle, blame everything thats wrong with UK on EU, you're now debating with grown ups, get used to it for the next 3 monthsYour points may get a round of applause in UKIP world but nowhere else,
markwhite208 5pts @lambolives @Stur It seems to have escaped your notice that the UK has an enormous balance of payments deficit. A devalued currency would make it much easier for UK manufacturers to export their products.
lambolives 5pts @markwhite208 @lambolives @Stur absolutely right, mark. buit Shhh, remember, anything that remotely looks like it might favour a Brexit has to be shouted down. Project Fear won't allow it.
markwhite208 5pts @Stur Is English you second language or are you just being deliberately obtuse? My post is perfectly clear. If you disagree with it then state you case. Flinging around juvenile insults about the Daily Express and UKIP doesn't convince anyone. In fact your unhealthy obsession with UKIP leads me to believe you are a Brexit plant who is posting here to persuade the undecided to vote to leave the EU.
markwhite208 5pts @Stur Since you don't seem to have the intellectual capacity to understand the logic of the Ponzi scheme, let me explain. When all those young EU migrants get older and become dependent on the state, the UK will need more immigrants to fund their retirement - and so on ad infinitum until the population increases from 65 million in 2016 to 80 million in 2050. At least half this increase will be the consequence of migration from the EU. England is already the most densely populated country in Europe, and such an increase will result in further environmental degradation and a reduced quality of life. Why do you find this so difficult to understand?
markwhite208 5pts @Stur To sum up your position: I don't need to engage with the arguments because I am intellectually superior - whereas anyone who has doubts about the EU is a right-wing retard. If this is the best the pro-Euro faction can do, no wonder they're losing ground in the opinion polls.
Stur 5pts What a load of twaddle. England is the most densely populated in Europe? A 2 second search proves its not,How do you know what will happen in the next 30 years? How do you know that Poland or France become the next countries to be the most wealthy and we suffer a population decrease, in the 70s we were on our kneesRegurgitating UKIP talking points doesn't help you when you're outside your echo chamber
markwhite208 5pts @Stur Your intellectual superiority will doubtless make it easy for you to refute the mountain of research which shows that the impact of immigration on wealth per head is either negligible or non-existent. In the US for example, a National Research Council study (1997) found that immigrants added about one tenth of 1% of GDP per head per year. More recent studies in the US, Canada and Holland have come to a similar conclusion - that the positive effects of immigration on GDP per head are negligible. And even small gains vanish as immigrant populations get older. Add to this the fact that a surplus of cheap labour discourages business investment in plant, R&D, education and training, and it is easy to see why UK productivity is 20% lower than the G7 average - and why Britain invests a lower percentage of GDP (14%) than any other leading western industrial nation.
Stur 5pts @markwhite208 @Stur Do you crawl the net for information that confirms your prejudices ?Why are you quoting 1997 reports from USA, Canada and Holland?Why don't you quote current British surveys? Maybe because it doesn't fit your Murdoch/UKIP narrativeAnyway here's a sample from a current BRITISH!!! report, from the Prestigious UCL, there are many others that came to the same conclusion, although you won't read about it in the ExpressPositive economic impact of UK immigration from the European Union: new evidence5 November 2014European immigrants to the UK have paid more in taxes than they received in benefits, helping to relieve the fiscal burden on UK-born workers and contributing to the financing of public services – according to new research by the UCL Centre for Research and Analysis of Migration (CReAM)European immigrants who arrived in the UK since 2000 have contributed more than £20bn to UK public finances between 2001 and 2011. Moreover, they have endowed the country with productive human capital that would have cost the UK £6.8bn in spending on education. Over the period from 2001 to 2011, European immigrants from the EU-15 countries contributed 64% more in taxes than they received in benefits. Immigrants from the Central and East European ‘accession’ countries (the ‘A10’) contributed 12% more than they received.
Stur 5pts @markwhite208 @lambolives @Stur Funny that nearly every major business survey report disagrees with you, whether big or small companies they all think Brexit is damaging,,Who informed your opinion that a devalued currency is beneficial?In Brexit world Zimbabwe would be the most powerful exporting nation on Earth because its currency is worthless, Nursery economics for Murdoch/Farage Droogs
Stur 5pts @lambolives @Stur just boring opinions which are totally irrelevant, Try sticking to one topic and leave out your madcap theories,"Thousands of workers in Port Talbot (and elsewhere) will lose their jobs as their livelihood vanishes into the Global. modern, free-market. EU rules prevent state aid for our steel industry."Should we nationalize our heavy industries and bring back protectionism?
Stur 5pts is England the most densely populated country in Europe or not?Or are you just the most dense person in Europe?
markwhite208 5pts @Stur @markwhite208 @lambolives Your economic illiteracy is beyond parody. Zimbabwe's currency devaluation was caused by white farmers having their land confiscated - with the result that food production fell catastrophically. Too much money in circulation plus a shortage of food equals inflation. You can just as easily quote the single currency as a prime example of devaluation. When EMU was established, the value of the Euro was set low enough to promote German exports. If Germany ever reverted to the Deutschmark, it would be unable to sell its Mercs and BMWs to the rest of the world. To spell it out simply enough for you to understand, every major economy in the world has practised devaluation at one time or another.Why am I having to spend so much of my time educating you?
Stur 5pts @markwhite208 @Stur @lambolives AHHH smarty pants,, so the Zimbabwe currency collapse was caused by the land invasions of white farms?,,Typical Brexiter you get enough info to fit your racist narrative then make the rest up,The collapse in the zim dollar was caused by the nationalisation of mineral rights which had been given to companies such as glencore and Anglo American, the farmers were a media driven side issue , Food production in Zimbabwe had already collapsed, The problem was also exasperated by Britains refusal to compensate white farmers as agreed in the Lancaster house agreement, Also Mugabe's paranoid" If Germany ever reverted to the Deutschmark, it would be unable to sell its Mercs and BMWs to the rest of the world. "No economist outside of UKIP world has reports saying this. You get a bit of information and make the rest up.
markwhite208 5pts @Stur @markwhite208 So now you're saying that research is not valid if it is more than 10 years old or comes from Canada, the US or Holland. An unbelievably stupid argument even by your standards.Yes, I'm familiar with the 2014 UCL report. I have a copy of it on my hard drive. But it's a pity you didn't read it properly since it shows that if you go back a further 5 years to 1995, the fiscal contribution made by EU migrants is much lower than the figures you quote for 2000-2011. This is because the older immigrants are, the more benefits they receive. So 10 years from now, the net contribution of EU immigrants who arrived in 1995 will be negative. In other words, you are using statistics selectively to fit your narrative - which is exactly what you accused me of without being able to provide an iota of evidence.
Stur 5pts @markwhite208 so if i go back to the seventies i can say all migrants that came over are nothing more than a burden??This is ridiculous
markwhite208 5pts @Stur @markwhite208 @lambolives Not only are you economically illiterate but you are also a paranoid conspiracy theorist . I can't answer your post because it is evidence-free gibberish. You even contradict yourself. On the one hand you say that food production did collapse and on the other that I'm a racist for pointing this out. The only argument you have ever made is that anyone who favours Brexit is a racist who reads the Daily Express. And will you please get it into your thick head that I do not support UKIP or even Brexit.
Stur 5pts @markwhite208 @lambolives i said that food production had already collapsed you fool, Isaid THAT WAS NOT THE REASON FOR THE CURRENCY COLLAPSING,,, You have the same thick headed talking points as a UKIPPER so you might as well be one,Why are Brexiters ashamed of being associated with UKIPPERS?
markwhite208 5pts @Stur @markwhite208 I will try and explain this as simply as I can since you are clearly not very bright. I am not saying that immigrants are a burden. They pay their taxes like everyone else. Neither are they a drain on the economy. What I am saying is that long-term immigrants do not make a bigger contribution to the economy than non-immigrants. Nor are they needed to fund the pensions of an ageing population. If this is the case, then what is the purpose of immigration other than to provide big business with a surplus of cheap labour and to depress the incomes of the poorest?
Stur 5pts @markwhite208 @Stur Christ!!!"What I am saying is that long-term immigrants do not make a bigger contribution to the economy than non-immigrants."I just posted a UCL report that shows that immigrants made a larger contribution to the public coffers than localsThere is a million reasons why this is, disabled people tend not to be migrants nor elderly, nor the feckless and lazyIMMIGRATION IS A NET CONTRIBUTOR TO OUR ECONOMY !!!! Please don't reply unless you have a source for your silly claims
markwhite208 5pts @Stur @markwhite208 @lambolives Firstly, explain how collapsing food production and a corrupt government printing money does not lead to inflation. And secondly, tell me how pointing out that dispossessing white farmers led to collapse of food production is racist, except in the black and white world of a deluded fantasist. In any case, your arguments are completely irrelevant. My original point was that every major economy in the world has at one time or another used devaluation to promote exports. Only an idiot could bring up Zimbabwe to try and prove otherwise. You are correct in saying that I don't want to be associated with UKIP. There are arguments for leaving the EU but Farage and his party of buffoons have failed completely to make them. Sadly, as you have repeatedly shown, the standard of debate on the pro-EU side is no better.
markwhite208 5pts @Stur @markwhite208 As any teacher will tell you, the technique most likely to be successful with slow learners is constant repetition. So I'll repeat what I said about the 2014 UCL report - but this time in a different way in the hope that it might penetrate your thick skull. I'd explain in pictures in I could but suspect that even this wouldn't work.Firstly, as I have already said, the UCL report shows that the longer EU immigrants have been in this country, the smaller their net contribution to the public finances is. The earliest EU immigrants mentioned in the report came to this country in 1995. Assuming that they were in their mid-20s then, they would be in their mid-40s now. During the next 30 years or so, their net contribution to the public finances will become negative as they age. This is not just true of EU immigrants but also applies to most native born British citizens. I feel it necessary to emphasise this because otherwise your kneejerk reaction will be to accuse me of being a xenophobic little Englander.Secondly, you continue to ignore the research I have quoted on the grounds that it wasn't produced in this country - which makes you guilty of the same sort of chauvinism you accuse UKIP supporters of. Thirdly, you refuse to accept the findings of the Open Europe report at the top of this page, which quite clearly shows that the effect of Brexit on UK GDP per capita will be zero. You do realise that Open Europe is a pro-EU organisation, don't you?Fourthly, let me draw your attention to this article in the Guardian on February 20th. As you will know, the Guardian is a liberal newspaper in favour of the UK remaining in the EU. The author is Patrick Collinson, who says:"Anyone keen that we have a reasoned national conversation about the merits of EU membership should welcome the intervention of asset manager Neil Woodford, the darling of small investors, whose giant funds have big stakes in lots of major British companies. His view is that both the pro- and anti-Europe camps are employing bogus arguments. The mundane reality is that a Brexit is likely to result in either a small net economic benefit or a small net economic loss. Nobody can know which economic outcome we're likely to see. But the least likely outcome (of either) is economic catastrophe. Woodfords analysis, supported by research from consultancy Capital Economics, ties in with a separate report from think tank Open Europe........."As a final piece of advice, may I suggest that you cease embarrassing yourself on a public forum as your empty posturings will succeed only in persuading undecided voters to support Brexit.
LeoC87 5pts Getting out of the 'eurozone' debt based currency idea will be refreshing. Back to a gold standard and look 'In house' for solutions and products. We are good producers of quality in the uk and countries will want. The English language is the preferred and do you think America will really place us back of the queue? We need to lead the way in independence for smaller nations, to show them that they too may also leave and regain control, and not be slaved to a fiat currency backed by QE over printed dollar debt!
LeoC87 5pts Also to add, if more understanding was seeked with what history has show, understanding gold/silver ratio, baby boom coming to retirement, cashing of 401k. You might understand the world is in a dyer situation and needs a reset to void all this paper worthless American Dream. Collapse of the dollar - 5 years, new global currency soon after
knock_knock 5pts @markwhite208 When those migrants leave they take with them the positive impact they have on the UK GDP.i.e. you save a some but you lose a lot more because those people produce positive economic output they don't take from the system. I think you could save a lot more by stopping the crooks from abusing the UK welfare system.When I worked in the University a team of 3 EU citizens brought in European funds at the rate of 2MGBP. That's the equivalent of the salary of 13 British people for 5 years. Most foreigners that come to the UK take advantage of opportunities this great country gives them and make a positive economic impact to the country.
lambolives 5pts @Stur If I were you I'd look up "Ponzi scheme". Even someone with your lack of understanding should be able to understand that. I've even provided you with a link so it wont be that demanding to inform yourself. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme
lambolives 5pts @Stur I haver no idea why you think that the Leave EU campaign advocates are UKIP members. I'm certainly not and I dont think many are. Its sloppy thinking to brand political opponents without first understanding who and what they are. But you are who you are - so lets deal with that. The EU exists for the benefit of the wealthy. Whilst individual nations can do little about constraining corporations because they (the corporations and wealth interests) control the debate. The President of your EU ran a tax avoidance scheme in Luxembourg, remember.The City of London functions in much the same way. National governments are powerless to do anything about it as they would need to get financial reform through the EU machine which is impossible.The EU freedom of movement of Labour is a mask to force workers to accept jobs anywhere in the EU. Lost your job in Manchester - go to Marsailles. This is a direct and planned policy that attempts to break the bonds between a person and their community. Workers are simply factors of production - expendable and movable. Refuse a job ANYWHERE and you'll have your benefits cut.Same goes for Freedom of the movement of Capital. The Rich must be allowed to move their wealth wherever it suits them with little or no possible constraints or scrutiny from individual nations. Eire can offer Apple and Google a zero tax situation - it becomes a race to the bottom with the only winners being the Rich and their corporations.I am no Little Englander. I love Europe, love holidaying there, respect and enjoy the people and cultures there. I just hate the way the EU stifles any workers rights with waffle about 'modernisation'. Look at todays news, Stur. Cameron's dad benefits from a Tax Avoidance scheme and Cameron himself gets away with inheriting his dads corrupt money by saying 'its a private matter'. Thousands of workers in Port Talbot (and elsewhere) will lose their jobs as their livelihood vanishes into the Global. modern, free-market. EU rules prevent state aid for our steel industry. I dont recall the worries about state aid rules preventing the mass bailout of the banks a little while ago. A bailout of the rich bankers that control the EU by the rest of us. Can we change the banking laws? NO. The EU prevented even a full scale debate on the issue let alone actually doing anything.These things are obvious mate, either you understand them or you don't. If you understand - No explanation is required - if you don't understand - no explanation will convince you.
markwhite208 5pts S@Stur Firstly, you are a simple-minded bigot who assumes that a complex issue like EU membership can be reduced to half-witted left-right slogans. As it happens, in every election since the 1970s, I've voted against the Conservative Party. In the next election, I'll be voting for Jeremy Corbyn, a centre-left politician who is as unconvinced by the EU as I am. But I suspect the idea that a lot of people who support Brexit have never voted Conservative may be beyond the comprehension of a mind as unsophisticated as yours. Secondly, nowhere in my posts have I said I will be voting to leave the EU. At the moment I am undecided and may well not vote at all - but the more I am exposed to idiotic soundbites like yours, the less likely I am to support staying in the EU.
markwhite208 5pts @Stur A propos population density, Eurostat and World Bank figures show that England has a population density of 410 persons per square kilometre compared to 128 for the E28 countries. The same sources show that only the Netherlands has a higher population density but will be overtaken by England before 2050. As for your claim that British people will be migrating to Poland in their millions in the next 30 years, you would have to be truly deluded to believe this.